Hair What I'm Saying
"Hair What I'm Saying" is created to share real life experiences with real people in the beauty industry to promote healthy relationships with consumers and Beautyprenuers. We will get into the nitty gritty of the backend of hair/salon business to help consumers understand why certain policies are implemented in order to sustain a healthy balanced salon environment for both parties, while consumers share their unprofessional and challenging experiences behind the chair. The goal is to bridge the gap to understand one another's perspective in hopes of clarity and unity.
Hair What I'm Saying
A Mother's Journey Through Postpartum Hair Loss with Hillary Washington-Goodner
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Postpartum hair loss is a reality for many women, yet it's rarely discussed in mainstream pregnancy and postpartum care. In this episode, Hillary Washington-Goodner shares her personal journey; from minimal shedding after her first pregnancy to significant, unexpected hair loss after her second. She opens up about the emotional toll of watching her hair change, the surprising timeline of postpartum shedding, and the lack of medical guidance that leaves many women unprepared. For Black women, the conversation is even more limited, making it difficult to find relatable experiences and resources. Hillary sheds light on these gaps and offers insight into the unique challenges faced by women with textured hair during this time.
Beyond the physical changes, we explore postpartum hair loss's mental and emotional aspects, emphasizing self-care, patience, and resilience. Hillary shares her approach to nurturing her hair back to health with product recommendations, lifestyle adjustments, and a mindset shift that turns hair care into an act of self-discovery. Whether you’re experiencing postpartum shedding or simply want to understand it better, this episode offers valuable knowledge, support, and encouragement to embrace the journey with grace.
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Welcome back to another episode of Hair what I'm Saying. Today we have a very special guest, hillary Washington Goodner. Hillary is a dedicated school teacher, a loving wife to a minister and a proud mother of two. She is here to share her personal journey with postpartum hair loss, offering insight, encouragement and practical advice for other moms going through the same experience. We'll be diving into her challenges, what she's learned along the way and how she regained confidence in her hair and herself. But before we get into the show, do me a favor share this episode with someone who is pregnant or has recently had a baby. Postpartum hair loss is a reality for so many women and spreading awareness can help them feel supported and prepared for the journey ahead.
Speaker 1:Welcome to the Hair what I'm Saying podcast. I'm your host, kenetra Stewart. Today we have Hillary Washington Goodner joining us to talk about postpartum hair loss. Welcome to the show. How are you, hi? Thank you for having me. I'm so happy to be here. Of course, thank you for accepting the invite. Of course, I really appreciate that. When you jumped on, I was like yes, because I saw you had even responded when I was looking for a guest and I was like I'm sure Hillary probably got some experience with this Let me just reach out and nudge and see what she'd be interested in.
Speaker 2:I wanted to give somebody else a chance because I was a little like nervous about being on the podcast. But I was also excited about like the topic coming up, because it really is an important topic that is affecting women who are giving birth, things of the sort, yeah.
Speaker 1:So yeah.
Speaker 2:I wanted to join in Well.
Speaker 1:I think I need to take that as a cue from here on out, like maybe people are scared and maybe I just need to jump in and say hey, will you be on the podcast? You know, I choose you. Yeah, and I have some inquiries. I was just like you know, I had like a small little interview and I was like I don't know if it's going to.
Speaker 1:I know we've had multiple conversations behind the chair and I already know how the conversation can kind of flow and go, and so with them I just wanted to be a little bit more deep, right, right, you know, and it was just kind of surface. I'm like I want y'all to reach to my listeners' hearts and like really speak to them, you know, so they can know like they're not alone. This is an experience you know. Most women that get pregnant. They're going to experience it, you know yes for sure. Yeah, I just feel like you were the best candidate Period, you know.
Speaker 2:Period.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right girl, so can you introduce yourself to our listeners and let us know a little bit about your background?
Speaker 2:Of course. Well, my name is Hillary Washington Goodner. I go by Hillary Goodner, you know, officially got the name change. You know we're married now. All right, miss Goodner, I am, of course, a mom of two. I am a teacher, I am a wife, I am a creator. I am just all the things. I'm busy. That's what I am. Yes, you are. I am so busy. A little bit about me. I am hair illiterate. I don't know nothing about doing nobody's hair. I don't know nothing about doing my hair. We just be out here making something happen.
Speaker 1:Well, your, we just be out here making something happen well, your hair looks great.
Speaker 2:Okay, so I I think maybe in your mind you don't think, but your hair looks amazing. Look, I said I'm coming off my girl, I'm about to put my best foot forward. We're gonna get in this mirror.
Speaker 1:We're gonna learn to do something, and I did that you look good too, thank, you so when did you first start noticing changes in your hair after you gave birth?
Speaker 2:Oh, my, okay. So I have two girls and so the first time I gave birth I really didn't notice any changes in my hair after I had given birth, like whenever I was pregnant with her, like my hair had gotten noticeably thicker, like I mean, like you're not putting your finger through, ain't running your fingers through nothing like very dense, very thick, very compact, but I didn't really notice any like hair loss with her but my second child.
Speaker 1:That was when I experienced it okay, and that was truly an experience, uh-huh, tell us about. Tell us about it, tell us about it.
Speaker 2:Yes. So it kind of actually happened in two phases. And so I gave birth to her in July and during that time, like I had braids in and I was noticing that, even when I had the braids in, like my hair started thinning like especially around the edges, some places in the middle. So I was like oh, was like okay, well, it's nothing crazy, so maybe we're good, you know. And that was around the time, like you know, had just given birth, um was doing the whole thing with like breastfeeding, was still kind of like taking prenatal vitamins here and there, and so the thinning to me wasn't problematic. I was thinking maybe it was just like the stress, but I actually experienced hair loss about six months later.
Speaker 1:So in.
Speaker 2:January I had a new set of braids in and Kenetra. I'm telling you, I'm taking the braids out and I'm like looking at like my hair just like coming out, and at first I was like, okay, this is more than just like your average, like braid shedding. This is like the hair is coming out. And I remember, and I was so it was so funny because I was so calm about it, because I was like okay, I think this is happening. I got, this is happening.
Speaker 1:I had two handles.
Speaker 2:I figured, that's how you would handle it right like that's your energy girl, your aura.
Speaker 1:So I'm not surprised to hear that. I would have been more surprised if you say you would have responded more dramatically.
Speaker 2:I was like very calm about it, but like it was very striking how much hair I had lost. Like I mean, I had two handfuls of hair, not to mention like the hair that was in the shower, the hair that was like in the sink. I was so shocked that I had lost so much hair and like I was also like well, well, dang, like I mean, yes, be yourself, okay, please. I was like well, damn, like I already got low um density hair, so like losing so much hair, I'm like well, I ain't about to have no hair on my head. Yeah, like where is it going? Like what, what am I gonna look like?
Speaker 2:right, right, right right and I remember even then, like the spacing in my hair was really off, like it was like really uneven, my ends were really dry and brittle, like my hair was like woo yeah it was like it's unmanageable.
Speaker 2:Yes, and I remember, like just looking in the mirror and saying to myself, like what am I gonna do? Because, like I said when I started, like I don't know nothing about no hair, I don't know how to do no hair and losing all of this hair now that I have never experienced before, yeah, what am I going to do?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so did you have any? Okay? So once it set in, like, obviously I'm losing hair, Did you relate it to postpartum hair loss? Definitely.
Speaker 2:I knew that it was that Like I had already known like, and I think that was kind of why I was so calm about it.
Speaker 1:Oh, because you already knew what it was Because I was like okay yeah, this is postpartum hair loss Like this is what it is. Did you know what it was before you even started having kids? Had you ever heard of postpartum hair loss?
Speaker 2:No, because honestly, like I wasn't really that wasn't like my lane, I wasn't thinking about kids at that time. You know, like I didn't have any friends or people around me who had had a baby given birth, so like that just kind of wasn't my area of expertise, okay, and so it wasn't until, like, I actually got pregnant. And you know, you're watching all the videos, you read all the things, yeah, yeah yeah, so it was when you started, you know, becoming a mom that's when you learn like there's a thing called postpartum hair loss, yes, uh-huh, and I was like, oh my god, that never finds me scroll.
Speaker 1:But and, but they look at me social media too, girl, tiktok university, see, and because you know you think about it, my daughter is 16, uh-huh, so when I first experienced it, I'm thinking I got a bad relaxer right. My hair is coming like because it started at the perimeter first, like you said the edges. So I'm thinking like did she leave the relaxer on too long? Like what happened? Because I got a relaxer literally around the time I started experiencing all that hair loss. Yes, and I thought that for like four years.
Speaker 2:Let me tell you After the fact and I knew like I trust my braiders. My braiders are great, like they've always taken care of my hair, like my hair looks great, it's like great in the braids and I knew that it wasn't that. Yeah, and like you don't want to kind of go down a rabbit hole of like well, was it this, was it that? Like you know, all the things that I was like you know the most obvious.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and see, that's why I do love TikTok and Instagram and all these social media platforms, because y'all can kind of get ahead of all of this stuff, you know for sure you know, like I told you, for four years I was really stuck on. That was a bad relax.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:But not knowing like no, you experienced that because you just had a baby.
Speaker 2:There's a thing called postpartum hair loss, which is so shocking, like of all the things that we can experience. Right, we just had the baby. You know we up all night. If you're breastfeeding, you're doing it with that.
Speaker 1:And I'm about to lose my hair, and I'm about to lose my hair. Lord, lord, pick a struggle. Just give me one, right, just give me one. So for you it happened the opposite. For me, I experienced it with my daughter, but not with my son.
Speaker 2:So my first and not my second.
Speaker 1:See, that's crazy. Yeah. So, um, did you tell me about, like, any new hairstyles? What did? What was your first solution to try to solve this? Like, what did you do? Or did you even try? Or were you just too busy being a mom? You just like forget it?
Speaker 2:I'll worry about it later it was a little bit of all of that like after I lost the hair. Um, I really just kind of like looked at myself and I like was like no girl you need to lock in. Like I really want to grow my hair out. That's like just kind of been like my goal, my new year's resolution, whatever you want to call it. Like I want to grow my hair out to like the healthiest it's been, to the longest it's been, to like the strongest it's been. And so, after losing all of that hair and looking at myself and just like also thinking about where I am in my life with, like my husband being a minister, you know, being a mom also, just being a woman, want to take care of myself and just like look presentable. I already just said I'm like no, like I'm going. Being a wife and only having so many hours in a day doing hair almost feels like an extra test. It sure does.
Speaker 1:It is an extra test. Yes, it's really like. You know, it's good for your mental well-being when you have time, but it also can be very daunting on your well-being as well.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and again, I don't know how to do. No hair very daunting on your well-being as well exactly, and again, I don't know how to do no hair. Yeah. So having to like research products, having to think about like okay, how can I fit this in my schedule, what's the style that's gonna last?
Speaker 2:like how can I get in the mirror and do this like it really felt like okay, this is an uphill battle, but if you wanted, you have to work for it that's right and that's just kind of like where I've been with it, and so, like some of the styles I was trying, if I don't know how to do this, I know how to twist my hair, so you know we're gonna do a nice little twist. Though, yeah, we're gonna like do some um, like a flat twist and like wear that in the style and so just like trying to find ways to like give my hair a break from the braids yeah, low manipulation, yes, low manipulation, like low heat, like just something to do to my hair, to just like find a style that looks good, that lasts, but then also like that I feel like really good in.
Speaker 2:You know, absolutely, and I've really settled on like this curly, like do I?
Speaker 1:love my hair. The perm rise set, but you know we used to do the flexi ride set so the flexi ride.
Speaker 2:You did my first one and I've been hooked since then. I've been hooked since then and, like I actually did it for a wedding I went to recently, like this past weekend, oh yeah, and it came out so perfect. I was like girl, I was in the mirror praying, I was like lord lord, if you love me, you will help me get this hair together so that I'm not at this wedding looking crazy but you know, like we gotta get in the mirror, yes, but you know like when you're trying a new style, you already thinking in your head okay, if this don't work out, I can do it like this you know trying to figure it out and that's what I'm doing, but it worked out, thank God.
Speaker 2:And Because they usually don't, I'm going to keep doing that. Ooh, because they tell you before you go someplace, don't try nothing new, don't try, I am a strong believer. You hear me? That's me in the mirror trying nothing new.
Speaker 1:I am a strong believer in not ever trying nothing new. You know when you going somewhere, because you just never know you never, know, and my best friend taught me that, because for our senior portraits she decides she want to wax her mustache for her senior portraits and you know this is not professional equipment and she don't have professional experience and girl, she ripped that thing off and ripped skin off. Oh lord, thank god she was great at makeup but you know she taught me that when I was 17.
Speaker 2:Like I will never try nothing and I'm so happy that you are the type person you are, because some people got to be in the class to get the lesson. Oh no, you said, I ain't gotta be in the class to get the lesson.
Speaker 1:Some stuff I do, but that no, I was like I'll never do that.
Speaker 2:I will never, ever do that because I'm glad it worked out for you I may have to too, Because, girl, I was like I can't go through this wedding looking crazy.
Speaker 1:No, you cannot, you cannot.
Speaker 2:But I was at that wedding looking bomb girl the hair was nice.
Speaker 1:What'd you say the dress was looking. What'd you say? You was bomb.
Speaker 2:That's right that part right there. I know that's right.
Speaker 1:Okay, so we kind of talked about your initial thoughts. You said you were more calm. Were there any days where it kind of felt devastating, where you knew that there was hope on the other side, you know, or there was, eventually your hair was going to grow back, right, you know. But did the results come back as quick as you wanted them to, or was it really a journey and a process?
Speaker 2:It's still been a journey. I think I've been really calm about it the entire time Because in my mind, just like you said, like it's hair, it's going to grow back. You know, like I'm not putting that much like emphasis on it to where, like, my confidence is affected. The only thing that was affected really confidence-wise was, like my confidence in am I going to be able to do my hair and get my hair and hit the goals that I want to hit. I still feel like I'm that girl have no hair.
Speaker 1:You are girl, let me take.
Speaker 2:So like my confidence wasn't affected because of that, it was more so like the confidence in my ability and so that and execute yeah, because, like I knew that I had goals but, like I said, I really don't. Like I get in the mirror and like it just feels like greek up here, like girl. What is going on? Like? What are these products doing? Am I using the right things? Like I got this low porosity hair, what this mean? Do I what I?
Speaker 2:use like because the hair is so fast there's so many things and there's so many people telling you you shouldn't do this and do this, and it's like you really have to figure it out for yourself you do, and some of these things they recommend you not to do actually sometimes work for you.
Speaker 1:It just didn't work for them and that's okay. Exactly that's why I'd be like do what works for you, exactly, you know it's. So. It's too much information out here, you know, to pinpoint your whatever your journey needs to be for you. It's too much information out here, you know, to pinpoint your whatever your journey needs to be for you. It's too much information for you to just try to listen to everybody, and I think that's why a lot of us don't enjoy our hair journey, you know, because it's just too much going on.
Speaker 2:That's exactly it, and so like it really has been a journey where, in a way, I'm giving myself that space to discover and to actually figure out. Okay, like you like this, you don't like this, you know.
Speaker 2:If you desire this result, it's okay to stretch your hair or like oh, to make this style last, you can do it like this you know, sleeping with the silk pillow cases, like and these are things that you know, we've heard, you know through, we've heard you know through a video, hairstylists, through conversation but like, putting into practice now has really helped me to actually increase my confidence. Now we're not way there, but it's increasing, yeah, and I'm really like You're getting there.
Speaker 1:That's all that matters. I'm proud about it. Progress yeah.
Speaker 2:And I feel really good about that. Good, but you know the big initial like striking loss, that happened like early January and so we are what mid-March now? Yeah, so still really recent, but like I think it's been going well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is going well. Yeah, I had to cut mine off into a pixie. It was so bad Really. Yeah, mine was very bad. It was, I bet, a pixie. Look good on you, though. It took some time for me to adjust, and even my family too, because you know, my hair has always been at least bobbling, yes. So when I came home with that haircut, nobody acknowledged it. I was like they don't like it.
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness, See, that would have sent me through the roof. I would have been like you know what. Let me go get that wig.
Speaker 1:Girl and wigs were not a big thing back then. Right, we're talking about early 2000s, wow, you know. Yeah, so a wig was like that's what grandma did. We didn't wear wigs, you know, it was like so in error, but I really didn't have no hair to really. Right, you know, we had partials. There were no closures, so the breakage was so unruly that it wouldn't even lay down.
Speaker 2:That's crazy yeah.
Speaker 1:So if I wanted to leave out, it was just gonna be poking up or sticking up and so, uh, my sauce was like, girl, we gotta cut it. We have to cut this off into a pixie. But when I came home I realized like this wasn't a great move. It was just a move I had to do. I'm like I am in here looking dramatically different, right and everybody just carrying on conversation and pretending like they're not we're not going to acknowledge her.
Speaker 2:We're just going to move on. She had that baby.
Speaker 1:She's just going through a phase in her life. Oh my gosh, it might have happened, maybe almost like nine months later.
Speaker 2:Wow, and that's so crazy, like that timeline, because again, like I experienced it in two parts Yep, like the initial, like maybe two months after, and then yep, like the initial, like maybe two months after, and then like the big one, like six months after yep, and it's just like crazy how that happened, like did you do anything different? Like what was I don't know.
Speaker 1:I think, um, when I could not style my hair no more, you know, like the edges were so broke that I would try to apply a product to it and it wouldn't lie down. And so that's when I really noticed, because it just kind of started at the sideburn area and then it just increasingly just went around the perimeter and then it started receding. Yes, and I only had this middle.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, so I had to cut it all up Because, like, my hairline has always been just like really even, like really like straight across, like just very like even in terms of like the hair distribution. Yeah, girl, when I saw them edges leaving and receding and I was having like gaps, I was like, oh my God, this is it. I can't be out here looking like that.
Speaker 1:Yes, Because you know the kids be quick to be like she ain't got no edges and you around the kids.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's right, I ain't got no edges.
Speaker 1:And what I'm going to say. I'm just going to sit there, girl. I be seeing the TikToks. I be like Lord, I couldn't be.
Speaker 2:Listen, you got to be a strong confident person you do, and you got to be kind of ready to give it back a little bit too, absolutely, oh, I wouldn't be having punchlines. School refines my sarcasm year after year, because let me tell you, I gotta be ready because they be quick or they'll be like you ain't got no edges but you're still cute girl.
Speaker 1:At least they back door with a compliment. Some of them just leave you there with your feelings.
Speaker 2:You ain't got no edges, but you a good teacher.
Speaker 1:What they gotta do this ain't got nothing to do with my hair girl. Oh kids, were there any myths or misconceptions that you heard about postpartum hair loss before? Hmm?
Speaker 2:Um, I don't know if there was anything that I heard per se.
Speaker 2:I think the biggest gap, I'll say, for me was not seeing women with my hair type go through it, and so my idea of postpartum was always like the women with like just like naturally straight or just like the longer hair and it's just like, oh, I'm pulling my hair and it comes out, or it's like just like really straight hair, like I had never really seen women like type 4 texture or like a kinky or a coyly texture go through postpartum and like what that looked like.
Speaker 2:And so when I experienced it and I'm like looking online, like, okay, postpartum hair loss, um, for 4c hair, like you know, then a few things started coming up but you really don't see a lot, no, and that was kind of like, okay, well, what is it like? What does it look like? Right, you know, how do I grow my hair back, like how does like what does this actually look like for people who look like me? Yeah for sure. And so that was kind of like, I guess, like the myth of per se, like the gap, the misconception, like it's just there's not for me, at least from what I've seen, things look like people that look like me who've experienced hair loss.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's not a lot. Do you feel like we're just not as open to being vulnerable on the platform when it comes to hair loss, since I feel like with us, as Black women, our identity can sometimes be associated with?
Speaker 2:our hair.
Speaker 1:So do you think it's that, or what do you think that's a?
Speaker 2:really great question. I think that has something to do with it, because I remember I was like I want to show her a picture, but I was looking at my camera roll I couldn't even find a picture. So I kind of like went off the grid after I lost hair a little bit in terms of like photographing myself.
Speaker 2:And so maybe for some reason, or for some women, that is something that they're like, you know, like because our hair really is tied to our identity. You know how we style our hair, how we wear our hair, how we feel about our hair like all this tied to our identity, and so it's not surprising that I didn't see anything, but it was still surprising Because this is an issue that affects women who give birth, have kids, all the things.
Speaker 2:And so it was interesting to only see a certain demographic or a certain hair type shown, and not the other.
Speaker 1:Yeah, even for myself. I wonder if I could be brave enough to do it and I do hair right. You know I'm like could I be trying, you know, just open enough, transparent enough, vulnerable enough to like, like, share, like and it is really vulnerable, like because that's something so personal.
Speaker 2:It sure is like I'm losing my hair. I didn't even talk to my doctor about it. I did not. I hate that they actually don't bring this my hair.
Speaker 1:I didn't even talk to my doctor about it. I did not. I hate that they actually don't bring this up. You know, they don't even talk about postpartum depression. And then you know, and that's one thing, and then we're going to add hair on top of the layer of all the things. And I'm like, why don't y'all inform your patients about this? And also, what are the solutions to try to at least slow it down? Because it's going to happen.
Speaker 1:Right, it's really hard to prevent post yeah, postpartum hair loss. Right, it's really hard, I know, for me, I usually encourage my clients to just keep taking your prenatals, like, try to take some type of hair supplement. But the only thing is, when you do that, that's actually for something from within. So the new hair is going to be be okay, but what has already grown out? Exactly what's gonna happen with that? You know, um, especially if you don't catch it in time, you know, right, sometimes when they come to me, they're already experiencing it. So, taking a hair vitamin, it might slow it down. I don't even know if it really helps sometimes, right, and I let them know I don't know. It could possibly help.
Speaker 2:it just depends on what your body has to go through, and that's the thing it's, and I think that's also probably the reason why I didn't talk to my doctor about it, because the experience is so specific to you.
Speaker 2:Yeah like pregnancy, it's like all of it. But I one, I'm talking to you about something that's like really like personal to me, yeah, and sometimes when you talk to a doctor and, like you know, I encourage people to talk to the doctor but sometimes when you talk to a doctor, they're just giving you like the very like general medical advice and being like, well, you know, this is gonna be like for you like okay, well, you ain't giving no solutions, you know, and I think you hit on a really great point about do you like?
Speaker 2:do they care Like? After you give up when you pregnant, you got appointments every month. Yeah, of course, the end every week almost. And then after that, god forbid, is something more serious than you in there, more than that. And then after that you got that six week appointment. They're like bye.
Speaker 2:Like good riddance, like girl, and you don't see them again exactly there needs to be some post-op care exactly it really do, it really do like I'm out here losing my hair and you're gonna send me home with a paper and, and it could be too, they probably just so wrapped up in the science of it all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like you're gonna be okay because it's gonna come back and I think that's why they can't or they don't connect right, you know.
Speaker 1:But it's like we are people, you know, and you practice this. It's not my practice to understand biology and human anatomy and physiology that's what you do right and you have a very great understanding of, but that does not reflect for me, you know. I'm like I just wish they would at least encourage some type of I don't know something. Definitely, uh, oral, yeah, you know, because topically, nothing can help you. If it's, if it's like a medical, right, you know. So it needs to. The target needs to come from within. Right, we need to target it from within. So it's like they can't recommend nothing really topical, and I can't either, like, besides, like, make sure you're just taking care of your hair, but it's still gonna fall out, right, you know. So I wish that they would at least come up with some type of oral supplement that really targeted, before it even happened, like, hey, look, as soon as you drop this baby, start taking this oral supplement you don't lose your hair and just like the conversation about okay you know like this is happening.
Speaker 2:Yeah, or this will happen or can happen. Just the conversation.
Speaker 1:Just the conversation, just the awareness can bring you at ease whenever it starts to unfold.
Speaker 2:Yes, you know, that's right, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Did you try any home remedies, treatments or products? If so, what worked for you and what didn't?
Speaker 2:I can be a product junkie. I can be a product junkie, um, but for this, especially because, like my goal is so specific about like growing my hair out longer, fuller and stronger, I've actually just like slowed down on, just like buying a whole lot of different things and instead, like I'm starting to like more, do more research on products, and so I really haven't bought a lot of things. Um, I don't want to name drop any products because I know they're like kind of going through um certain things, but there is a specific hair like target to black hair.
Speaker 1:There's a specific brand that has, like some hair growth, drops that people you know, they know, they know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2:You don't have to name drop, yeah yeah, and I used to use them, but then, like I was hearing all the things, I was just like you know what. I'm gonna back off and I'm for a little moment because I'm already experiencing loss. I don't want to exacerbate the issue with a faulty product or whatever the issue is, even if mine is great.
Speaker 1:Let me just leave that alone for a little bit. Then you'll be backtracking to trying to fit. You know it's like now you got two problems that you gotta fix. Yeah, nobody got time.
Speaker 2:No so, um, I've found products that are like, more nourishing for a hair, like just saying, okay, these are the three things I'm identifying with my hair. I'm experiencing breakage, I'm experiencing dryness, I'm experiencing like low strength or, like you know, loss of elasticity. So, like, what are the specific products that are going to speak to these things?
Speaker 1:And let me use those, and so far they're doing really well.
Speaker 2:Like you know, I'm a Sephora all the time and I'm getting a sample of this. I'm going to try this and like giving it time to actually work.
Speaker 1:That's the thing, Cause sometimes we we try it one time and we think we're supposed to see results as soon as we apply this product. It's like no. It takes time and consistency in order for you to see this product really do its job.
Speaker 2:Yes, Absolutely yes, and I just believe, also, like when you invest in certain products, like you're going to see that investment back If it's directed and meant for you, yeah, like. And meant for your hair, yes. And so, like you know, getting those samples and saying okay well, this has been working let me invest in this product, you know, and like not trying to hop on a trend.
Speaker 1:Yes, that has been really helpful.
Speaker 2:So like home remedies. No, I've seen different like hair growth stuff, but like again, that just feels like another task yeah, and I'm already busy, so I need something I can go to the store and pick up and say okay what are your favorites in Sephora that you've tried so far?
Speaker 1:Ooh.
Speaker 2:You say I love Sephora, let me tell you me. And Sephora, that is ooh.
Speaker 1:I love Sephora. I know I was in there yesterday. God forbid Ooh Love.
Speaker 2:Sephora. Okay, so I have tried. I want to say is this the Vegamour?
Speaker 1:Oh, yes, the hydrate shampoo with the biotin v-e-g-a-m-o-r. Yes, I've tried that. I like that shampoo a lot, okay, so y'all heard that that's a good one.
Speaker 2:That's a good one. It worked so well for my hair. It was like hydrating, but then also like just very cleansing, and like my hair did feel stronger okay you know like I've been doing the uh flex Rod sets and I think before when I would have like experienced breakage and stuff like my hair's been feeling like really strong.
Speaker 1:So that's a good one. It looks good, yeah, thank you it do.
Speaker 2:So. That's a great shampoo that I've been liking. What's another one? I've been using the Amika.
Speaker 1:Hydro Rush.
Speaker 2:Amika yeah, the blue one yeah that mask oh delicious yes yeah, amica is really making a huge breakthrough. Yeah, yeah I like that one a lot. I really like that one a lot. Um, I've tried some curlsmith that I've liked, liked. Oh yeah, you like Curlsmith, yeah, so an influencer actually that I watch on Instagram she used to use it years ago before she locked her hair and it had been on my list to like try, but I hadn't like picked it up because you know, like the pricing and I was just like you know, I don't know if it's going to work.
Speaker 1:But I got a sample of it and I was just like you know, I don't know if it's gonna work, but I got a sample of it and I tried it and I'm like, oh, I like it and it smells good.
Speaker 2:I've never tried curlsmith. I like them okay. I like them a lot, they're good. I have to try to check them out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay, and I also use um pattern you know what it's only, out of all of the people I've ever talked to, it's only one person that did not like it, but the majority of people really love patterns.
Speaker 2:So when they first came out, I tried it. When they first came out, did not like it. It did nothing for my hair.
Speaker 1:Okay, she had to go back in the lab.
Speaker 2:She had to go back in the lab. I don't know if it was just me, but she had to go back in the lab. She had to go back in the lab. That was maybe like three, four years ago. I tried that, okay, and I picked it up again, maybe like within the last year, and I've been liking it. The Apollo Santo leave-in conditioner oh, I've heard so many great things about that Girl. I didn't go through so many bottles of that one, oh my goodness. And their treatment mask. It's like a protein mask.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh when I tell you my curls pop like curls. They never pop before, but the curls pop with that treatment mask, y'all get the deets. Yes, yes, yes, that treatment mask.
Speaker 2:It is like chef's kiss. I love it. Oh, and the mousse. That's what I use, um, when I do my rod set, but those are like my like top pickups. So far, okay. I have my eye on a few other things. Okay, I want to want to try Sacred.
Speaker 1:I heard the oil is really good. I want to try Sacred yeah, you know I love Beyonce.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love me some Beyonce so I want to try Sacred. But the things that have worked so far are those products I've listed. Okay, I've had good results, okay.
Speaker 1:I haven't heard anything negative about Sacred yet you know, I've only heard.
Speaker 2:The hype is the oil is what I hear about the most. That's what I want to try that's.
Speaker 1:That's what I hear about the most is the uh, the oil they say kind of reminds you of like that olaplex number seven oil.
Speaker 1:Okay, like that's some real great oil to compare it to. So, and so far I haven't heard anybody say anything negative about that oil. There was one influencer who only gave it a negative, I guess, review because he felt as though it didn't cater to all patterns and he said only because there was no styling products for curly hair. Um, curly hair, but you know you don't have to have like a right, a specific right. You know, product for straighter texture, exactly like, and if you want them curls to pop, you definitely need something else going on in their product and some people just have like naturally straight hair, so it's like you know you can.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's exactly what I mean, but it's like it's not gonna curl yeah, that's why he was saying, he felt as though it was more catered to a more looser textured um demographic.
Speaker 2:That's interesting, you know.
Speaker 1:I feel as though um you don't need a, um, not that you don't need if the product line is built for hair care and restoration. I don't know if you need it yeah. The pops to, I mean the curls to pop.
Speaker 2:Right, you're just looking for restoration, exactly. You know strength and like, if you heal your hair and you restore it, then like naturally, some of those things will happen. Right, yeah, like less is more.
Speaker 1:Right. So to me I was just kind of like I see where you're going, but it's just that I don't feel the true connection to how this doesn't work, right? That?
Speaker 2:makes sense. Sometimes people just like those extra products in their routine, and I'm not mad at that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they do, but less is best. Yes, for sure, it sure is. Let's see, I got to figure out where I'm at y'all, we got so deep in that conversation I was like wait a minute, where are we? Okay, here we go. Oh, did you feel supported by your doctor's family or community during the time you were experiencing postpartum hair loss? Or was it even a thing you felt like you needed to bring up to them?
Speaker 2:So I remember when I was in the bathroom and I was seeing all the hair loss, I remember going to Marcus, my husband, and be like babe, I'm losing my hair, my hair is falling out, and he looked at me. He was like all the hair on your head. What? No, it ain't. He's like I can't see it. I'm like, no, babe, like, look like, and I'm holding it in my hands. I'm just like, I'm like it's falling out. But I'm like, no, babe, like, look like, and I'm holding it in my hands. I'm like it's falling out.
Speaker 2:But I was like but it's okay, because it's like postpartum hair loss Like this happens. And that was pretty much it. Like, I think like your community will really like respond based on how you react. So, like me being kind of like, okay, like, but this is my goal, like this is what's going to happen, this is what we're going to be doing, like this is my year to do it, I think everybody was just kind of like okay, yeah, well, you can do this and make sure you're not doing this and like just being really supportive about it.
Speaker 1:And like even Marcus was just like well, if you feel to, because he knows, but it was only so much I can do. I know and I knew that too.
Speaker 2:It was just like you know. There's only so much I can do. I'm going to just have to go through this and we're going to get it together.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that'll be that, Like it's not. I didn't feel like I had to go like run to a salon. Yeah, I was just like OK, this is just like a phase, it's going to happen, it's natural. Yeah, you know the hormones, the vitamins, like all of the things like let's just get through this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, get on the right track and then we'll go from there. Yeah, but you know I told you I didn't talk to my doctor and so like I just kind of like left that part alone and stuff, but I would say everybody's been like really supportive, yeah, I would say everybody's been like really supportive. Yeah, and I think also too, like the support didn't necessarily come in the form of like a solution. Always it came in the form of just like an affirmation Like oh, your hair looks good today oh wow, like I see you did something new with your hair Like oh, you tried that.
Speaker 2:Like I like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And like those little like nuggets, also make you feel like okay, I'm good I'm doing something like it's not as daunting as I think right, yeah I know, um, even when I experienced it, I you know I I could have done other things.
Speaker 1:I could have got a quick weave, you know, I think my hair would have probably responded to that being that it's no foundation, no, right, right braided foundation. You have to lay it on right especially cutting it all off, I think.
Speaker 1:I could have done something with that, but I do remember being I was in hair school when I experienced it. I remember like walking from my academic advisor's office, kind of like thinking like I'm probably going to cut all my hair off, and I was like, ooh, I can't wait for another three years. I was like Lord, I can't wait for another year. So I think too, even for myself, it was just like. I think that was like my main thing and I think that's why my community was like yours. It was like, well, she not really stressed about it, she didn't cut it all off. So obviously she's okay, you know. But there are some of my clients that you know they won't cut it off, you know, know they don't want to start over.
Speaker 1:Um, even some of them don't have to, though it's just literally right there at the perimeter it just depends, but there are some, you know, clients that I've tried to encourage, like in order to see quicker results, not in length, but in the integrity right right because it's so unruly it's so unmanageable yes, you can't do really anything, and it's so crazy how it get like that, because why are you acting like yes, like unruly child?
Speaker 1:so I'm like at least you can start seeing the benefits of it being healthy, and then you'll be able to appreciate just having healthy hair versus being so tied up to length. Exactly, and that's where I'm, I've always been. It's like oh no, I will cut dead raggedy hair.
Speaker 2:If it gotta go, it to go, it got to go, it got to go, and that's it.
Speaker 1:You know I don't try to hang on to it because I want to see it at its healthiest. Exactly More important. That's more important for me than length, right? But I have noticed with some of my clients they're like no, weave it up, braid it up. And it eventually grows out, you know.
Speaker 2:so it's um, it takes some time, but if you just kind of cut it off and gone straight to the new grow where the new hair is coming in, you know, it's gonna grow eventually it's gonna grow and it's like do you want it to like grow and like you have your new growth and like this healthy hair, or you want to have like all this, like old, like dead, like it ain't doing nothing, it ain't curling right, my hair ain't laying right. That's why it's not laying right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what did you learn about postpartum hair loss that you wish more women knew, or even women like you, like when you were explaining earlier?
Speaker 2:What did I learn? It really does look different for everybody. You can have something as mild as just like shedding, or something as severe as like full blown, like losing extreme amounts of hair, but I think that there are so many things that affect it, right, you know, it's the hormonal fluctuations, it's the vitamin deficiencies, it's the stress, and there's just so many things that can affect that. So, yeah, it's just, it's a really like I hate to sound like the doctor, but it really is like your own experience. So you know, just, that's kind of what I've learned, like it's your own experience, and so make it your own.
Speaker 2:Like you know, that's something like your body is going through all of these changes. Like go through it with like grace. Yes, give yourself like time and be patient. Like don't feel like the need to like stress about it and like throw yourself to frenzy about I gotta get my hair back. You know, like, just take it, be like how you have to embrace your new body. I'm gonna embrace my new hair, that's right, and we're gonna get there eventually. This is a new you. It's a new day, right now, so embrace it.
Speaker 1:Like you said, and I also like how you pointed out, the experience is different for everyone, so also walk in that, knowing whatever information you see out here, you know where people are sharing it's not going to look like everyone's. Like you said, you didn't lose nearly as much hair as I did, you know. So it is different for everyone, you know, and that's I'm glad you said that that needs to be said more than anything. Yeah, because just because it's not looking like what you're seeing on the internet or what you are reading on, that does not mean right, that's not your experience, you know exactly.
Speaker 2:Or the experience of someone experiencing postpartum and, like you said, like with your second, you need to experience I ain't experiencing it. No so, with my first I didn't experience, and so, like you know, I think that sometimes, like when you become pregnant, and you start like looking at all the videos and you're like preparing yourself, like don't stress about something that has not happened yet, you know, like you can be proactive and you can prepare.
Speaker 2:But don't go into it like worrying and being like, okay, well, I gotta start taking all the supplements now. I gotta start doing all the things now, like enjoy your process, recognize that it is a process and wherever you're going to fall out on your journey is where you're going to fall out on your journey, that's right and just go at it from there.
Speaker 1:That's right, yeah, yeah. Are there any key nutrients or lifestyle changes that help improve your hair health?
Speaker 2:Low manipulation hairstyles um giving my hair like a break from the braids, like I love braids. They're easy and it's like really convenient for me, like as a mom absolutely who is so busy?
Speaker 2:but you know, one thing that women are doing after they have kids is trying to reclaim some time for themselves. Yes and so like redefining like my hair as like, as a chore, like, instead of looking at it like it's a chore and being like, oh, I gotta do my hair, I'm like, okay, I get to go do something different my hair, let me go try something. Mental, yeah, mindset, yes, and like I think that's a lifestyle it sure is. And just like carving out that time to like try something new, to do something new, to just like take care of yourself, even if you're just doing like a cute little slick back bun, do your little, cute little slick back bun, use this product, try something. Doing that, making sure that you're eating like nutrient dense food. Yes, you're not going to get everything from your food, but it helps when you are eating and putting certain things into your body, because what's in is going to come out.
Speaker 2:So you want the stuff that's going in to be good yeah.
Speaker 2:And finding a good like multivitamin, like, if you are, you know, in that still early stage like taking those prenatal, still like you know, taking those supplements that are going to just again like put some good stuff into your body, because a lot of it also, too, is like the vitamin deficiency. That's right, absolutely. And so treat your body like. Treat your body like you're still pregnant, like because, even though you're not taking care of that baby anymore, and then like putting it the good stuff into your baby, yeah, like you still love with your body okay, like it's still you and it's not the same, it's not the same, so you really need to be on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you want to take care of yourself.
Speaker 2:Um other lifestyle changes, other things, um what is like iron, vitamin a like vitamin b.
Speaker 1:Yeah, all of that like.
Speaker 2:You know, just really honing in on, like, okay, this is what I need for my body, for where I'm at, let me go find these supplements, get these foods, you know, to nourish myself. And just look at this whole process as, like I'm nourishing myself.
Speaker 1:And be unapologetic about it too, because the baby's going to be there. Your job is going to be there. The baby's definitely going to be there.
Speaker 2:But you know you got to take care of you.
Speaker 1:You sure do have to take care of you, girl. I love that Period. Yes, ma'am, I love the period. Have you started noticing any regrowth at all? I have. Okay, how long did it take, when you know, from the time that you initially noticed that it was you know you was experiencing hair loss to now the regrowing process?
Speaker 2:it's been really recent and so, um, I blew my hair out, like this past weekend, and when I blew my hair out I was like, oh, my hair has gotten a little longer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm like okay, like at first, like I had got my hair and it was like cut up to here and stuff, but like now it's like getting to my shoulders like when I blow it out it's like feeling stronger, like my edges are still thin but they're like growing back, so like the hair is coming back and so it's been really recent, maybe like week or two and stuff, and like I think that's also like the products I've been using, so like again giving things time to work. You know, like now I'm starting to see small results and stuff and that's encouraging.
Speaker 1:I also think your mental yes is helping you too, because I feel as though if you're stressed, it's gonna slow down the process or it's not gonna be any. Yes, so I feel like you know, just listening to your feedback and just us, you know, having this conversation, all I hear is positivity. Yeah, you know, making sure that you know, inside I feel good too, right, you know, and I also think that's also helping your stimulation.
Speaker 2:I think so too. Yeah, and also like you just got to get your community involved. Like on. Tiktok. They're just like scalp massages helps promote growth. So I'm like babe, yeah, oh yeah, Scalp massage, my scalp Girl. If I could just get 10 minutes of it yeah, 10 minutes of something.
Speaker 2:So it's just like finding like fun ways to just like put it in my day, put it in my schedule, so again it just doesn't feel like a chore. Yes, so again it just doesn't feel like a chore. And that mental is really important. And I think, like again I locked in after I saw that hair loss and I said, okay, no, my goal is this, because this aligns with who I see myself, where I see myself. You know like I'm doing things. I want to look presentable and my hair is a part of it, and so let's lock in and let's get this together.
Speaker 1:Amen, sister of that, and so let's walk in and let's get this together. Amen, sister, what advice would you give to other moms currently going through postpartum hair loss? I feel like you just been dropping all the gems on. You know how to move forward, but if you got something else, right, I'm all about encouraging moms.
Speaker 2:I'm just going to go back to give yourself grace. Give yourself grace in the space that you are in. Um, you are new. Yeah, you are a new person. You are a new woman.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you are experiencing all these changes in your body and you can look at that and you can, like, get really like depressed, you can get really like sad about it because you don't recognize that person right, but recognize there is so much power in the new you. Yes, you know, like, and look at what you're losing as an opportunity of what you can gain. Oh, my hair is falling out. I'm not used to this. I ain't never had short hair before or my hair has never looked like this before.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, maybe this is my time to try a new haircut or a new hair color or rock a new style. Yeah, like, what's my mom's style? Like, who am I in this new body that you know? And so just like, really like giving yourself the grace and the space to just operate in all that is new, all that you, and just making it fun. I think sometimes we get so caught up in just like. This thing is happening to me, I got to be so serious about it, you know, or this is a serious thing, like nobody's taking me seriously.
Speaker 1:But like have fun with it.
Speaker 2:Have fun with being a mom, you know. Have fun with just being a new woman, just like, just have fun and just give yourself just grace and space to figure it out and talk to people. Oh my gosh, sometimes I feel like Community.
Speaker 2:Yes, you can be on your own little island and you can just be spiraling and you're looking at all these videos and they're just validating all of your concerns and you just feel like, oh my gosh, like this is never going to get better. But like, get out there and go talk to some people. That's right Because we've all experienced it or we're all experiencing it. Are you going?
Speaker 1:to. If you plan on being a mom, you're going to experience it If you want that precious baby.
Speaker 2:You're going to have to go through some things to have that precious baby. You're gonna have to go through some things to have that person's baby. You know for real. Yeah, so that would be the advice that I would give to like moms and women and women experiencing like postpartum hair loss okay.
Speaker 1:If you could go back, would you do anything differently? And how you handled your postpartum hair journey, especially since you didn't really know much about it until you experienced it for yourself or started? You know, planning to, you know be pregnant no, no amen.
Speaker 2:I have enjoyed the journey thus far and again it is like really provided me an opportunity to discover, yeah for sure. And now I'm discovering with like more intention, with like more purpose and with like less stress about the result.
Speaker 1:I'm just having fun with it. That's right. Just embrace the process versus trying to rush to the solution.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That's right. Yeah, how has your experience changed? You know the perspective on beauty and self-care for you.
Speaker 2:Hmm and self-care for you. Hmm, um, I think that when people envision like their best selves, they always envision themselves like the fullest everything I have the prettiest skin, I have the longest hair, I have the most banging body. Like I have the best wardrobe. It's really allowed me to enter, like beauty and self-care, from a place of humility and not vanity. Yes, like I'm not trying to be popping for the world to give me validation, like I want to just be so secure and confident in my own self my own, like my own, whatever I got going on that I just feel like, oh yeah.
Speaker 1:I got my own validation going on. This is the only validation that's needed when it comes to external validation. It's not even real. It's only real if you make it real.
Speaker 2:Exactly and like really you dress enough for the trend that's going to change next week. Or you know, like the people that's on social media, like where everything is filtered and pretty and you know they got the most popping light. Like you know it's just living in the now and just being so real, being just like being just grounded in.
Speaker 2:This is who I am right. This is what I like. I don't feel like I have to fit the trend, no. So if I want to put my little face mask on at XYZ, I'm doing that. That's right. And, again, just having fun with it. I love going to the store and finding a new face mask or a new something like oh, I want to try this, and just doing it.
Speaker 1:It's a journey it is, and it's so much fun it is, it is and I'm doing it.
Speaker 2:It's a journey, it is, and it's so much fun it is, it is and I'm doing it along with your kids, right, you know, like I'm in a kitchen with the face mask on and I'm cooking spaghetti. Yeah, that's right, just finding a way to just be like nope, this is my time. Yeah, Like y'all done.
Speaker 1:Because we can lose our identity whenever we start, you know, building our families. Yes, it's like I'll take care of me wherever, whenever I can Right. But I really like how a lot of moms are inserting that intentionally today. They're like oh no, we're not doing what we did back in the day. No, no, no, we're not doing that. It happens too easily.
Speaker 2:You can easily lose yourself. You sure can and you do not want to do that, because you'll look up them kids will be grown, they'll be doing their own thing. Your husband's been living life and you'll be like, well, where am I going? Where do I start now Exactly? No, thank you. Nope, I'm going to get Mimi right now. That's right, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay, where can our listeners connect with you or follow?
Speaker 2:your journey. Oh well, I like y'all. That's if you want them to. You know, I like y'all. I'm here with y'all. Um, I can be a little private online, you know you. You see me, but then you don't, right. But I'm on tiktok, I'm on Instagram, I'm on Facebook wherever you feel like you need to find me. I think it's at Hiller Chanel I don't even know the ad name to give y'all yeah, but I think it's at Hiller Chanel, you at all child.
Speaker 2:They can come follow me. We can talk more about it. Maybe it'll increase our community.
Speaker 1:I'm not mad at that right, it could, because I like that. You know this could be a way to support women. You could literally start, because I feel like your mindset and your emotional connection to who you are from within is something a lot of women need. So you could really start an online community and this could be a way to support women who are going to go through it. They look like you, since there's not a platform out there, right?
Speaker 2:now I'm not mad at that and I'm more than open. You know, of course, online you navigate, you know, like how much you share, how much you don't share, and I think I've navigated that balance well you know, like whatever I don't want to tell you. I ain't gonna tell you that's right I'm totally open to doing that. Like I love talking to other women, I love stuff like this, like yeah, and just having conversation.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I think it would be a great thing. Y'all can follow me if y'all want to.
Speaker 2:I ain't gonna block you. I'm so nice. I'm gonna like your post every now and then you can follow me.
Speaker 1:It's so funny. But no, girl, I really thank you so much for carving time out of your day to come see me. It's so good to see you. It's been way too long it has been. It has been Like three years almost, yes.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:September will be three years.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, so it's been. A lot of life has happened, but I'm just so proud of you like carving out this space, yeah. Having these conversations, just like the work that you are doing, and like in community in the hair world. Just like I don't know, I'll be your online fan girl.
Speaker 1:Girl, stop, I'll be like, that's my girl. Girl. I appreciate that though, Because, like, sometimes you just don't know if you're doing what people want. Yeah, you just don't know until somebody tell you like I really love what you're doing, like I hope you can keep it up, girl, you are doing it and people are watching and we are loving and we are so excited for you.
Speaker 2:So thank you for having me like. This is truly an honor. Yeah, oh, thank you. Yes, when you first launched a podcast, I was just like I want to be a guest on.
Speaker 1:Kenetra's show. I can't believe you didn't tell me. I'm glad I just nudged you. I was like oh, because even when I saw you mention it I was like okay. I was like ugh, because even when I saw you mention it I was like okay. I was like but she don't sound like she want to be on the show though. And then I got a couple nudges after I put it out there.
Speaker 1:I was just like that's not what I'm really looking for. You know, girl, be shy. I was like I'm going to hit Hillary up and see what Hillary say, because we've had so many great conversations.
Speaker 2:Oh, we have so many.
Speaker 1:I already knew it was just going to flow. And then, like listening to how you, you know, were at the salon, like you was just so confident, yeah, or is so confident, yeah, and that's where I wanted this show. I wanted it to go in that direction, like someone who has lived it, experienced it, and that's thriving, right, you know, so that the listener can hear that story, yes, versus like the, you know, kind of daunting and you haven't really arrived there yet I mean we all go through that yeah, like every challenge comes with like that period of just like uncertainty, of like, okay, like, where's the light in this tunnel?
Speaker 2:right, yeah, I mean, just come out of it so empowered you know just like I'm all about finding the opportunity where there seems to present none, and I think like being a math teacher has also helped me with that, because in my mind, every problem has a solution. That's right. And so it's kind of like OK, this is a problem, but I can solve this.
Speaker 1:That's right, absolutely, I can overcome this. I love that analogy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, girl, you know I'll be, I'll be all over my head with it. But, yeah, like I pray that women walk away from this episode feeling empowered, whether it aligns to where they are in their lives or not. Like you know, I pray they share with somebody who they know is like OK, girl, you're pregnant, this could be you, but let's, let's come out of this like Right, empower, right, Absolutely. So I I'm excited about who this is going to reach and what is it going to spark from here. Yeah, I'm excited about it All right, girl.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate you. One amazing conversation with Hillary. Her journey through postpartum hair loss is one that so many moms can relate to, and her story is a powerful reminder that healing, both physically and emotionally, is possible. Hillary, thank you for your honesty and for sharing your wisdom with us, to our listeners. If this episode resonated with you, or if you know someone who needs to hear it, be sure to share it. Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review and follow us for more real conversations about beauty, hair and self-care. Until next time, stay empowered, not only through your hair, but from within. Thank you, thank you.